Talk:Questions and Answers
hello Andrey, do you have Gerber files for 10342 and 10347 boards you can post? thanks George
Hello... I am interested in using the 363 camera board(s) for a project that would allow people to convert their old still film-based cameras to digital use (digital still camera, NOT motion). And before anyone points out the obvious, yes, I know that you can buy a full frame digital camera for probably less than this project would allow someone to convert an old Nikon F or a Canon AE or Leica M series to digital usage. But, it needs to be done and since no one else has picked up the baton, I guess I must be the one. There is a treasure trove of old lenses and cameras out there that are going to waste and a large portion of photographers who don't care about auto-focus, LCD review and other bells and whistles that are available whether you want them or not.
What I am initially looking for is someone who is very familiar with the circuitry of the 363 camera. It would help me a lot to be able to ask a number of questions on how to simplify the circuit easily. Much of the features of the 363 will not be needed and I want to find out what needs to be "tied to ground" or can be left dangling or open on the circuit and not be used.
Anyone? thanks George Chicago
George, I don't think there is anything you can really save on by not using some features. To build 363 camera you need 10353+10342+10347+10365 if mechanical shutter is not needed, otherwise - add 10368. Mechanical shutter may be needed if you have exposure times less that about 1/1000, that is needed because of the limited shutter ratio of the electronic shutter (some light still leaks while sensor is being read out).
If you have any specific questions about the boards - please go ahead, post them here.
--Andrey.filippov 23:53, 22 January 2009 (CST)
Hello Andrey, thanks for the response...I'm currently reading the entire DVinfo thread and trying to get up to speed. The reason I'd like to "edit" features is to reduce the size of the boards needed. I'd like to fit the electronics into existing still-film camera bodies and as you know, they're pretty small. Your current pc board size for the 353,347 and 342 I think will work just like they are, but there's no room for the 365 and 368...although I have yet to try to mock up the pc boards for a physical fit trial...as a secondary comment may I congratulate you and your associates on your great work and I wish you continued success... George
By the way...I can't seem to find anything on the 10365 board...can you direct me to where info is? thanks...George
It is a power supply board for the 10342+10347 - CCD needs a lot of power for readout, vertical phase currents are in amp range. It seems this board was never documented on the wiki, as well as the other one - 10368, mechanical shutter driver. I'll work on it --Andrey.filippov 15:06, 26 January 2009 (CST)
No description pages yet, just the files:
--Andrey.filippov 15:44, 26 January 2009 (CST)
Thank you Andrey... here's some summary questions that I've been working with Alexandre to formulate for the wiki...
Let me see if I am correct in my understanding...
1. The 10353, 10342 and 10347 are the core boards I need for a 10363 camera to use as a base for my digital still image camera (no motion needed).
2. They will all work on 3.2v battery power (well regulated...no over power...no under power or does under-power matter?)
Yes, it does matter. Processor will be reset and reboot if voltage goes too low (hope no writing to flash at that time). But 3.2v battery will most likely fail during frame readout - the power is about 12W during this process. If voltage will drop, system will be reset. And generating CCD voltages from 3.2 will be very inefficient - I would rather start from higher, like 12V (or 18V-19V like in notebooks)--Andrey.filippov 19:41, 27 January 2009 (CST)
3. If I don’t want to expose a frame faster than 1/1000 sec then I don’t need mechanical shutter board (10368)...everything slower than 1/1000 sec can be handled by electronic shutter in the KAI11002 sensor, yes?
Yes, especially if the exposure is even higher >1/100. Around 1/1000 they could be some visible vertical artifacts that in some cases could be software corrected--Andrey.filippov 19:41, 27 January 2009 (CST)
4. The 10353 (or 10363 as it is known when using the 11002 sensor) has onboard memory that could keep, let’s say, 20 full frame still camera raw images until downloaded to pc? Or does it need an additional memory board to be able to do this?
Total system memory - 64MB, currently we use 19MB as image buffer (for compressed images). It is probably possible to increase it, but you'll need to be careful and remove all the unneeded applications that use memory. That may be not so easy as you'll loose software compatibility with the default software and upgrades. And that is for compressed, not raw images. 1 raw image for 11 MPix camera will need around 22MB, you can fit maximum 3 of them in the video memory (64MB)--Andrey.filippov 19:41, 27 January 2009 (CST)
5. when I have this all hooked together, will the camera be able to boot from internal memory to work as a true portable for 20 raw still images, or will it always need to boot from a pc?
Camera does not need any PC to boot, it boots from internal flash memory--Andrey.filippov 19:41, 27 January 2009 (CST)
6. Do I absolutely need the 10365 power supply board and what is it's physical dimension? if it is the wrong dimensions for my needs, can I redesign to other physical dimension and will it also run off the 3.2v battery power or does it require more battery power?
10365 generates +1.2V, +5V, +6V, +15V, -15V, +27V, and as I wrote - starting from 3.2v would be less efficient, than from higher voltage. 2-d dimensions are in the PDF file (and also in Gerber ones) --Andrey.filippov 19:41, 27 January 2009 (CST)
Did you consider using a medium format twin lens camera like the Rolleiflex? Cameras like these are inexpensive, but high quality: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolleiflex You'd need a 60mm x 60mm sensor of course, but you'd have something really special. Maybe you can fit the boards under the mirror, i think that's an empty space.
Hello Oscar, thank you for the idea...however, the medium format area has been solved by the various producers of medium format digital backs. today, you can get a used digital back for a Hasselblad V series camera for a little more than $2000USD. But, the classic 35mm still film cameras have no such upgrade path available. The reason of course is that the major companies want to sell new equipment, which I understand. But there are many of us out there that want the possibility of bringing their old equipment back to life. Plus, and I think this is key, for many photographers the extensive features and menus of today's DSLRs are annoying and interfere with the classic photographic creative process. So...my project continues! thanks again for contributing your thoughts. George
I have a couple of questions that can help me start designing my mechanical needs right away if you could possiblly help.>>
1. Can you tell me dimensions of the 10342 and 10347 pc boards? Length and width?
2. From what I can read on the wiki, am I right that the sensor mounts to the 10342 board and then the 10347 board can be connected to 10342 by flat cable?
IF so, what is the thickness of the sensor plus 10342 board?
If not, what is the thickness of the sensor plus 10342 plus 10347 boards?
Thanks much... George
Feb 16/09 Hello, are the pc board patterns and Gerber files available for 10342 and 10347? thanks George